County Commissioner District 3 Online Forum

Welcome to all of our PCOs and the candidates who are seeking the appointment to replace Commissioner Bob Macleod in District 3. Thanks to the candidates for spending 3 hours with us yesterday to tell us who you are, why you want the appointment and you positions on various issues facing the county.

As you all know, we PCOs have a responsibility to select three candidates who will be forwarded to Commissioners Wolfe and Romero. This forum is just another opportunity for discussion amongst our Thurston County Democrats community.

The format of this online forum is simple. At the end of this post is a link you can click to comment. Feel free to leave questions for candidates, comments about candidates, and anything else you feel is relevant to the discussion.

Candidates can respond to questions by replying to the comment that asked a question, and others can reply to those responses by commenting on comments.If you have any questions, just leave a comment for me with the Subject header "Ken" and I'll respond as soon as I see them.

We'll plan on staying online as long as folks have something to say. Don't feel like you need to be here until the sun goes down or constantly at your computer. The comment thread on the blog will stay live and you can check back in later tonight or tomorrow and add your 2 cents.

The Ground Rules

1. Please keep the comments respectful of everyone and no personal attacks on candidates or other's opinions.

2. If you support a particular candidate or candidates, please tell us why. Don't just leave a comment that says "I support Candidate X."


I'd like to kick-off the forum by asking one question of our PCOs who are here today:

What are you looking for in a County Commissioner? What qualities do you believe the person appointed to this position sould have?

And to our candidates who are with us today:

Why should you be appointed to the District 3 seat? What makes you better qualified for the position than your opponents?

Thanks for to our candidates and PCOs for your participation today.

Feel free to continue posting

After 2 hours, I'm going to head off to some family obligations. Thanks to our PCOs and to Gayle Broadbent and Karen Valenzuela for joining us here today. Please continue to post your questions and respond to other's comments. We have until tomorrow night to determine who we want to represent us as County Commissioner.

Thanks Ken

I really appreciate your efforts on this forum and with the blog in general. Hope our commissioners (and candidates) can see how this kind of technology might help break down that barrier between the people and their government.
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Jim Culp

Considerations for CC candidates

I ran for County Commissioner in 1996 and 2000 in District 1 and have had an interest in county government for a long time. Back in the 1980's we had a BOCC that the whole state looked to for progressive policies. That changed in the 1990's and we have not yet recovered from those years. With the election of Sandra Romero, there is new hope that the commission can be a leader again rather than meeting the low expectations voters have had for county commissioners. In the next year or two it is going to be pretty grim in terms of budget issues and any commissioner appointed with have to do unpopular but prudent cuts. But we need someone with vision and ideas, who can help lead the county to institute forward-looking policies again. As I see it, there are 3 issues that need to be addressed. 1. Remove the perverse incentives to sprawl we currently have by not having appropriate impact fees in the county. This would have a positive budget impact as well. 2. Create alternatives to incarceration for minor offenses so we don't overburden the criminal justice system as we have been doing. 3. Do what is needed to protect our environment, including water quality (septic checking) and keeping rural areas rural by down-zoning to rural densities. We need to keep this a livable county for ourselves and our kids as well as getting through this budget mess. Both Karen Valenzuela and Walt Jorgenson have that vision and will get my support. I also think of Gayle Broadbent as a "dark horse" candidate. She is smart, a quick learner and has her heart in the right place.
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Steve Langer

Times are Changing

Vision is the ability to anticipate a future that exceeds conventional expectations. I don't believe any of the candidates excel at this, but Walt does seem to think further outside the box than most.

I particularly like his honesty, especially his recognition of the need for and the sources of supplemental tax revenue. Discussions of increasing taxes is not a comfortable subject and is one that most candidates studiously avoid. I'm glad to see that he put impact fees on the table. I believe that increases in revenue are inevitable if essential county services are to survive, however I would like to see more discussion of equity and the actual anticipated impacts.

Walt's environmental stance demonstrates a commitment to a positive future and I believe this goes hand in hand with vision. Discussion of optimal density and zero growth should not be outside of a county commissioner’s purview. I would like to see a discussion of a sustainable future that generates as much enthusiasm as did the prospect of endless wealth during the stock market bubble, abet predicated more on rationality than greed. This will require attention to the needs of human beings, immersed in their environment.

Our criminal justice system as it is presently constituted is a bottomless pit, both socially and economically. We need a strong leader to lead us away from this precipice and at least Walt has taken a strong stance on this.

I believe that too much is being made of electability in the 2009 election cycle. None of us can predict who will ultimately be a strong candidate for this race. Times are changing far too fast, and it will be the person who adapts to these changes that will likely be the stronger candidate.

Also, the current commissioners should be willing to accept the will of the PCOs, who arguably are closer to their constituents and thus to the electorate.

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Progressive Guy

The Electability Issue

I agree that too much is being made of electability. I think there is also a big difference between being an incumbent and a challenger, where the incumbent, if reasonably intelligent and articulate, has tremendous advantages that are difficult for a challenger to overcome. As a result, whoever is appointed is likely to stay on the job once there. I believe that a number of the candidates who have applied would be able to withstand electoral challenges, so we need to be sure the commissioners pick someone who we want to stay there for a while because s/he best embodies our values and has a clear vision for the future.
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Steve Langer

But we are not making the final selection.

Steve, from a standpoint of policy and the area of policy that is most important to me, I agree with your comments. If we had an open seat and several candidates were filed for the primary my choice might be different in terms of who I activly worked to elect. This last time, for instance, I worked for Sandra Romero. The problem is that we are not making the choice of who will fill the seat. That choice will be made by Cathy and Sandra. In this environment, do you really think that an applicant with environmental views as strongly held as you or I hold them can get the support of both commissioners? Diane was not on board and Bob bless his heart was not engaged. Now with Sandra already elected, a third commissioner who is moderate enough to get both Cathy and Sandra's support and then work on these issues may be what we should aim for. The last thing we should want is a deadlock in terms of who they select, or a candidate who does not run well in each of the next two years.

We're helping them to make that decision

Steven: I appreciate your comments, but I think that both Cathy and Sandra will take our recommendations very seriously and we should recommend who we think is best. I think the issue is not just the environment, but it is certainly one of the big issues, in large part because it has not been taken seriously for a long time. The whole global warming mess tells us that our electeds need to take it seriously, at all of our peril. People are beginning to understand this. And being a strong environmentalist does not mean the person can't also be good on other issues as well and be elected. Let's not try to figure out who they might want, let's give them who we think would be best in the position. Just my humble opinion.
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Steve Langer

Some concerns I have

A couple of concerns for me:

Without naming names, there are some candidates (and it is more than one candidate doing this) who seem to be trying to dazzle us with the number of ways and times they invoke Barack Obama's name.

I think as Democrats we're all very appreciative of all that President-elect Obama has done, and the model campaign he ran, but I'm getting tired of hearing his name with regard to this race.

Barack Obama isn't running for County Commissioner. And trying to tie yourself to him isn't likely to help you with getting the votes of PCOs. So to the candidates who invoke his name, tell us specifically what elements of the President-elect's campaign you admired and how you intend to implement them in your campaign in 2009/2010? Please be as detailed as possible.

And my second concern is that until yesterday at the forum, I hadn't heard from at least half of the candidates. Now I don't consider myself too terribly important, but I am a PCO. If you're seeking this appointment, you need my vote and the vote of enough of my fellow PCOs to make the top 3. So to the PCOs, I'd ask if you're considering someone who hasn't bothered to call and ask for your support or doorbell you and why? And if you're a candidate who hasn't been calling or doorbelling PCOs please tell us why.

Obama exploitation and calls

Agreed, while I can accept that the choice for some to put themselves out there may in some part as a result of being inspired by a great leader, a few went much farther than that. As for phone calls, or lack of same, the county party could have done more to instruct applicants on the process and acceptable tools at their disposal. Self motivating creativity may be a good test but should not be THE test in determining who we and then the two commissioners select. IMO.

Obama references

I would just blow by all the Obama references and not worry about it too much. I listen to what each candidate has to say in a substantive way about how they would govern as Thurston County CC.
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Steve Langer

Regarding yesterday's candidate forum

I've got video uploaded to my laptop from yesterday's forum. If all goes well I'll have it uploaded to YouTube and posted on my blog and right here at TCD Blue, later tonight.

Ken's question to candidates

Thanks for hosting this, Ken, I'm starting to like this blogging stuff a LOT! Ken's question: Why should you be appointed to the District 3 seat? What makes you better qualified for the position than your opponents? I think nine years on the Tumwater City Council is valuable elective experience that prepares me well to assume this position. It provides me with familiarity with the issues that come before the County, knowledge of the major players involved, and the importance of citizen participation in discussion and decisionmaking. County Commissioners also serve the important role of our local Board of Health. I've worked in public health for over 20 years and have a broad understanding of the public health needs of our community, and how to formulate policy and programs to meet those needs. I've served on many interjurisdictional committees side-by-side with County Commissioners and City Councilmembers of neighboring jurisdictions --the Intercity Transit Board, TRPC, the Thurston County HOME Consortium, the Solid Waste Advisory Committee, the Human Services Review Council, CapCOMM, the Thurston Climate Action Team, etc-- and have learned the value of being part of a team focused on a project or problem. I revel in what I consider to be the major roles of electeds: being a planner and policymaker; helping to solve problems in our community; and being stewards of our community's vision, never losing sight of what we have said we want to be as a community. The role of County Commissioner will be as good a fit for me, I think, as being a City Councilmember has been. --Karen Valenzuela

Spelling

Karen, for the reasons I stated my opinion is that you would be a good choice. Ed may be a little bit stronger in terms of criminal justice, though I think you both would campaign hard and effectivly for reelection. Oh, and sorry I butchered your name.

Thanks for joining us Karen

Thanks for letting people know more about you and giving them the opportunity to interact with you online.

What I am looking for in the people who's names are passed on

The existing two commissioners will need to agree on one of the three we pass on and a three person commission is by its small size challenged to have a good depth or diversity of skills. Both Cathy and Sandra bring legislative backgrounds and this background has proven to be a good one. Cathy brings a solid record on services and six years of experience to the challenges ahead and Sandra brings a new and stronger environmental voice to the commission. So first, I am looking for a candidate who can compliment the two exceptional people who are charged with agreeing upon one person to replace the vacancy. Secondly, I am looking for another advocate for preservation of our environment and quality of life who is interested in aggressively looking at how new development might better pay its own way as we move forward. Thirdly, I am looking for a budget person who has a strong grasp of criminal Justice programs, policies and costs since this makes up over 70% of the county budget. And last but not least, I am looking for a person with the proven skills and desire to campaign continuously for the next two years to retain the job. With this said, for me, it comes down to Ed Crawford and Karen Valensuala.

Glad to see you made it

Thanks for adding your comments Steven. I'm glad they got your account approved.

You said:

Secondly, I am looking for another advocate for preservation of our environment and quality of life who is interested in aggressively looking at how new development might better pay its own way as we move forward.


I believe I heard Walt Jorgensen say he supports impact fees at the candidate forum yesterday. And that support sounded pretty strong to me.

And if you're looking for someone who understands law enforcement issues and the costs that go into those programs, Ed Crawford definitely has the experience as a state trooper and then as the city of Kent's Police Chief.

Re Walt

Ken, no doubt Walt gets an A in terms of environmental issues, but he lacks the background I am looking for in terms of running an agressive two year campaign and I do not think he can get support from both Cathy and Sandra. This opinion does not come from talking with the commissioners, but I think I have a good read on things.

Can you share with us

why you don't think Walt can get the support of the current commissioners? I don't know Walt at all, but was impressed by him yesterday, and I know he meets my expectation of prior elected experience.

Ken

If you play back the commissioners opening remarks, I think you will find the answer. I am not interested in putting words in anyone's mouth but the commissioners gave clear indications of what they were looking for.

I have their comments on video

But I'm not sure what you're getting at. Is Walt not a team player? Would he not have the commitment necessary to campaign in 2009/2010?

I didn't get those messages from Walt yesterday.

Am I missing something the Commissioners said?

All I will say.

Out of respect for the two elected commissioners and for Walt, I have said all I am going to say on line. If you wish to, feel free to call me. I'm in the book.

Walt

Unfortunately Walt has a track record as an "activist." He's well known in local goverment for trying to micro-managing programs. That's not leadership. His idea of vision seems to be a "utility tax" to generate more revenue. We already pay property taxes and there's a tax hidden in our phone bill to pay for county emergency services. I'm not a fan of additional taxes on utilities, they'll all be passed straight through to you and I.
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Jim Culp

Crawford

Hey Steven, good to see you there. I like Ed Crawford too, but I think he's more of a long-term guy in Thurston County. He has great administrative experience as Kent Police chief, but I think his county level bonafides are lacking, especially when it comes to growth management.

Ed Crawford

Emmett, your comments are within reason. Still, I would hold that a length of experiance in dealing with the budget choices ahead trumps a length of being local. As for the environmental issue, all I can say is that several of the candidates do not pass this test and a few have been a little deceptive. Ed is not one of those, and while it is not environmental issues that drew him to apply, I have spoken with him a length and am convinced that he is looking to help Thurston county in avoiding the errors made in King county over the past 10 years. I think Ed has a solid shot at gaining support from both Cathy and Sandra and if chosen will work well with both of them in changing the counties direction on environmental issues.

elected experience

For me, the best qualification is to have already been elected to a position. After combing through the applications, I limited my choices to previously or currently elected officials.

Other than that, I've tried to suss out whether I agree with them on some issues that I think are important for the county commission (such as home rule and technology in government).

Emmett O'Connell
Olympia 48

I agree

Thanks for dropping by Emmett. I agree with you that for me, elected experience is my number one qualification. Given the situation with the county's budget, we need a seasoned leader.

Also, since there is a Democratic majority on the Board of County Commissioners, we can expect the Republicans to invest heavily into this race. We need a strong candidate, with a record to run on, and the ability to raise money and hit the ground running on the campaign trail as soon as he/she is appointed.

Ken Camp
Tumwater 28

Another vote for experience

With a budget in crisis, and only one experienced commissioner, we clearly need someone with demonstrated management experience. Since I'm in a rural NE area, protection of our rural aquafers is also a high priority for me. I really don't want to see my drinking water pouring out of sprinklers in box store parking lots.
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Jim Culp

Welcome to the forum

I'm now online and watching the comments, so feel free to join in.

Ken, thanks for hosting this blog.

I thought the forum last night was an extremely good experience. I was excited to see so many people come out on a Saturday afternoon in order to participate. I was so impressed by the other candidates and what I heard and read from them, so I anticipate being very pleased and satisfied with whatever outcome emerges. I was glad I got the chance to bring attention to some of the issues that I feel are very important, such as the necessity for updating the critical areas ordinances (CAO’s) here in Thurston County. We are so far out of date with our current regs, and we NEED those CAO’s in order to protect our water quality, wildlife habitat, wetlands, the waters and shorelines of the Puget Sound, and the public health and safety. I remember going to a public meeting on the CAO draft on August 17, 2005, there in the county courthouse, and being so excited that we were finally going to get some updated CAO’s…that was almost three and a half YEARS ago. And our CAO’s were about a decade old even before that! Where are our CAO’s? We need them, now. And then once we get them, we need real monitoring and actual enforcement of these regulations, which is something that Thurston County has demonstrated little will and effort for thus far. Another thing we need is a ‘Working Lands and Forests Preservation Plan.’ As a member of the Agricultural Advisory Board we have been working on this for over a year now. We need more resources and assistance in creating a good plan, and Thurston County needs this plan quickly. It’s true the breakneck pace of development has slowed recently, thanks to the housing/credit bubble bust and the economic recession, but that won’t last for forever. I don’t want to see Thurston County paved over, jammed with poorly planned subdivisions, turned into a McBland McPlace. We need to take actual, concrete action to save our farms, forests, and preserve our quality of life. We have great people here in Thurston, educated, passionate, committed people, and I hope that we all use that passion and commitment to require that our county commissioners do whatever is necessary to preserve and protect the wonderful and unique place that is our home. Gayle Broadbent

Gayle

You are so right, in regard to the CAO, not to mention the lack of a water manual or clear, science driven surface water policy, impact fees, basin plans...and on and on. Will we flounder on until it really is too late? I do not wish for us to become like King County. Still, the GMA is designed to be phased in first in the larger counties and their is much to be learned from what the huge counties up North have done right and wrongly in this area.

Thanks for joining us Gayle

Thanks for being here and for participating in this forum Gayle.

You said:

I was so impressed by the other candidates and what I heard and read from them, so I anticipate being very pleased and satisfied with whatever outcome emerges.


I get the feeling that you've participated in this process to bring light to issues that are important to you, and that you're not expecting to be appointed. That's not a bad thing, in my mind, if it brings about the change that you're seeking.

Don't sell yourself short Gayle. You may not be as experienced as some of the other candidates, but your passion for the issues you bring to the table was very obvious yesterday. You are impressive in your own right.You might not be ready to be a County Commissioner, but you've proven to me that I'd want you on my side if I was running, and I'd probably be seeking your counsel on environmental and land use issues.

Regardless of the outcome of this process, I hope you'll continue to stay involved.

Thank you, yet again

Thank you so much, Ken, I really appreciate your words. It is true that actual issues are what most concern me, but perhaps that is a good thing. Someone who mostly wants to be county commissioner because they want money or prestige or enjoy bossing staff around—what kind of commissioner would that be? Not the one I want for MY beautiful community. I want some very important things to be done, and I don’t care who does them, as long as they ARE done, and done right now, because I’m tired of waiting. We should all be tired of waiting, and we must all demand swift, decisive and effective action from our electeds. Here’s what we need: --Updated critical area’s ordinances. (CAO’s). This is just so big. The subject could fill a book. In short, though—updated CAO’s, right now. --Actual monitoring and actual enforcement of regulations. --Better planning of our development and transportation systems. We squander our chance for a sustainable, healthy future when we give away density, allow sprawl and pave over our forests and farms. We waste incredible amounts of tax dollars, too. --A more efficient county government. --Increased public involvement in county government, policies, and priorities. --Inventory of our actual water supplies. --A firm commitment and an actual plan to preserve farms and forests. There’s more, and the challenges facing Thurston are immense and will probably increase, but we can do this, and we must do this. And Ken, I certainly will stay involved. I know I’m glad you're involved, and thanks again for the effort you made to provide this blog forum. I meant what I said at the forum, each word. Thurston County is the best, most fabulous, wonderful and special place I’ve ever been. I feel so lucky to live here. Our home is worth every effort and every care, from me, and from all of us. Gayle Broadbent